Old idea in a new embodiment

The idea of \u200b\u200bcombining the heating device with the surface of the wall is not new: for the first time it was implemented in the late 60s of the last century, in the midst of panel construction. For this inside reinforced concrete panels The cavities for circulating the coolant were provided, and the heating layout scheme was formed during the installation of panels and the construction of the house.

The success of wall heating systems has become the result of an accurate engineering calculation and impeccable construction quality. Coolant passing inside concrete Wall, It was heated with its surface up to 50-60 C.

Heat spread over the entire wall area and was transmitted inside the placement of radiation. In this case, the convective component of heat transfer is completely excluded.

It should be noted that in homes built on conscience (and there were not enough such in the USSR) the wall heating system is working until today, pleaseing the tenants of the high level of comfort.

Unfortunately, widespread wall heating did not receive. Probably, the complexity of installation and high demands on the quality of concrete panels with built-in reservoirs for the movement of the coolant are affected.

The idea of \u200b\u200bwall heating in the new, modern video, returned with the advent polypropylene pipes, unique properties Which can be mounted from them not only warm floors, but also warm walls.

How are warm walls arranged?

To ensure comfortable conditions in the room, just warm enough to make only the outer wall, which goes into the street, compensating for the loss of heat into the surrounding space. If it is decided to heat 2 or more walls, then for each of them you need to make a separate heating circuit, connecting it as well as the heating device.

The polypropylene tube is placed on the surface of the wall with loops, the long side of which can be located vertically or horizontally. Both options are possible, but with a horizontal location of the loops and the upper connection of the coolant supply, water will move down under the action of gravity or gravity.

With a vertical location of the loops without a circulation pump, it is not necessary: \u200b\u200bthe heat carrier has little chance to overcome the forces of internal friction in the system, especially if the pipe length is several tens of meters.

The laying of polypropylene pipes on the surface of the wall is carried out without the use of additional thermal insulation materials. Under the pipes do not need to lay a layer of foil or vaporizolation.

It is desirable that the walls have minimal heat losses, and their thermal insulation was performed outside the building. Otherwise, the location of the dew point can be shifted inside the building, which will inevitably lead to the formation of dampness on the walls, and thermal energy will be spent on drying walls, and not on the heating of the room. Outside the surface of the walls can be plastered or closed with panels.

The step of laying polypropylene pipes, may be different: no restrictions in it. Usually pipes are placed with a smaller step at the bottom of the wall, and with large intervals in the top of the wall.

Benefits of warm walls

The use of warm walls for home heating allows you to significantly increase the area of \u200b\u200bthe heating device compared to conventional heating radiators. And since the heating area increases, it is possible to obtain an equal amount of heat, reduce the temperature of the coolant, for example, up to 50-60 s, and this is already low-temperature, more comfortable for humans, the heating system.

In addition, with the help of warm walls, it is possible to reduce the share of convective heat exchange, replacing it with more comfortable thermal radiation.

Hello!
Very help.
I do warm walls all over the house. Problem - Walls plastered MP - 75 Gypsum plaster. She misses warmly. They say warm walls need to be plastering with a sandy solution, for better heat transfer. It turns out incompatibility. What a way out of the situation.
Wallow the walls, the house from the porotherma, damages the porother.

In fact, the plaster and cement plaster are very compatible. I even, when plastering walls with cement plaster, put longitudinal beacons from the plaster, since with the subsequent application between the cement plaster, it clings to them even better than the beacons glued from the same cement mixture. And for nothing will give a crack.
The fact that the plaster does not spend the heat - also strange. It may be a little worse than the cement-sand mixture, I do not know, but firstly - the thickness of the layer above the pipe will be only 3 - 3.5 centimeters, whether it is worth bothering about that the thermal conductivity is better in sand cement or gypsum. Most likely the difference does not even feel.
That's just recently, I made Leningradka, drowned the pipe into the wall, wrapped it with thermal insulation, and shouted the Rotgips stroke. Deep was shit. Over the pipe is more than 4 centimeters, it turned out, and that, in one place the seeded section of the wall instantly heated, after the system is turned on. I was crushed, it turns out thermal insulation at the junction slightly separated. So in my opinion you are worried.
I actually do not know the plaster MP-75, maybe it has some reinforced heat insulating propertiesWell, let them remain there where there are, and the pipe is closely cement, and then the gypsum will be expensive, there will be a thick layer. And everything is necessarily combined, verified.
Of course, to give a more accurate advice, I would have a photo of at least one wall, with an encountered place where the pipe laying is planned.

Hello!
Thank you very much for the answer. Plaster KNAUF MP-75.
I will send a photo later.
The masters say the cement-sand plaster is stronger if it is imposed on a hyposy - it is weaker, with time, she will break her, and after a couple of years will disappear by the layer. Two different materials. And it turns out that the bottom layer is weaker. If on the contrary, then there are no problems.
Gypsum poorly misses heat so masters say.

I do not understand how you plan to put the pipe into the wall. Why the question of plastering the whole wall rose. Let's find more, and 100%, find a solution.
The fact that the plaster does not miss the heat - nonsense. But so that the cement plaster does not fly away from the plaster, there are several techniques: make a notch deeper, fill the grid more often ...
There was a case when one ... .. Aligned the walls in Hamam Rotbandt. In the rotband pipe flush. The area is large, and so that everyone does not count, I made a segmented sticking and put a grid of 9 dowels per meter. Then cement-sand plaster, waterproofing and mosaic.
No, no, I go into this bath, I did not move the layer.

Hello!
Food in order.
The house is built from 44 porotherma. All walls are plastered by KNAUF MP 75, since radiators and a gas boiler were planned.
Plans changed, install the heat pump and the home heating will be warm floors and warm walls.
Winding of the walls of the pipe Reheau F 10 on the project is simply in the porotherma, in my situation on the plaster. Without foil gasket. Pipes are closed with cement sandy plaster. It is impossible to apply a strong one for a weaker plaster. Here was the question of how to get out of the situation in the parts of the walls where the pipes will be winding and how to stucked them
Shoot down the plaster, how carefully knock, if the porothers, more precisely, so that it does not crumble inside ..

Yeah is now clear, you do not have a niche for pipes. Just the situation as in the article. Only you have a paraterm, but in it to make a normal niche of course freezing, if at all really. Without a reflector - also minus.
So it pulls to ask, do you need warm walls? Will one warm sex be enough? After all, if you put the pipe now, then you have to thicken the wall at least 3-4 centimeters. For a lot of reliability, you can go a gypsum by hydrophobe, that is, moisture-resistant primer, then fill the grid, then put pipes, then the grid again, as it is shown in the article, then apply cement plaster, and the top of continuing the gypsum. Such a fruit, if you think about. This consumption of material. I have warm floors everywhere in a fierce, and nothing else, no heaters. My wife and I are very thermal-loving, so that barefoot and in shorts. And it is enough, legs do not burn. Paraterm is also very warm material, can leave these headaches with a warm wall?
Here's another for example: the chief has a hunting room of 75 sq. M. One wall internal, the opposite - the virgin from the floor to the ceiling, and two walls in a half brick, hollow. These two are trimmed with drywall with insulation in Rockal 10cm. Heating only warm floors. We have frosts in Tatarstan are under 30, and in the hall is quite comfortable. I even somehow spent the night there - ok, warm.
Think again again. You can do everything. But what will it cost? And is it necessary?
And one more important remark. So I would do this design, because when I do a job, I myself turn into a pipe and in the plaster, and no one thing will slip away, which would not like this pipe or plaster, i.e. I do everything with a soul, and if you are doing this: yes, if I want to fly, then it can easily fly out later.
If the master can be trusted, then I explained to you. Yes, even, plaster on plaster, although plaster on plaster, too, only on the grid, and preferably with notches.
And do not dwell on the thermal conductivity of plaster. This is just one indicator affecting the temperature in the room. There is also the ability to accumulate heat, heat transfer, a lot of sand indicators, in short, on this occasion so much copies are broken on the forums, and unified opinion So not. But the reflector (foil), I would still put.

Hello, please tell me whether it is possible to make warm walls in the house from the sip panels under the plasterboard, the jolly of plaster from cement will not be there. Heating is planning or on an ion electrocotel or thermal pump. Thanks

Great. Issues are interesting, so let's think together, as I did not do anything like that, and therefore it was not possible to watch how it behaves.

1. SIP panel itself is very warm. Weakness Shakes, not even the joints themselves, otherwise they are made in the installation.

2. Under the warm walls, a reflector is needed, it means on the surface of the panel along the area of \u200b\u200bthe heating element (water pipes, infrared film, e-kabel), the reflector is attached, which eliminates the installation of plasterboard on glue. Only on the frame.

What turns out: Panel - Reflector - Pipe or Cable - Profile - Plasterboard. So between the panel and plasterboard, the air layer in which the heating elements are located. Air is very good heat insulator, and for electric cable This is fraught with way out. Or keep it at low temperature, which is meaningless.

Infrared films and water pipes remain. Infrared emitters survived the explosion of popularity, and there is already safely moving. The reason is that their heat is different from the traditional. I did, and felt on myself. If you sit in such a room without movement, it is noticeably cool, if you move, then warm. Water pipes remain.

They certainly warm the air layer, and in the end of the plasterboard are heated, but as far as it is rationally and economically I will not say. Pipes because it is flooded with stucco, which increases heat transfer, and evenly distributes heat.

About boilers know-how is not to me. Many have already appeared. By the way heat pumps It has long been known for a long time, but for some reason they have not received wide use, despite the enthusiastic comments. Reason for reflection.

I put a Russian oven at my dacha and a fireplace. Now I regret that in the cottage did not plan such heating. Of course, without a boiler in the cottage it would not work out, there is a workshop and a garage and hot water, but there would be great in the complex.
About the Russian oven do not yet ask - there will be detailed articles with pictures and schemes.

Good day!!! Thank you! Everything is clear and concise. Then we change the vertical on the horizontal and the bumpy water warm floor under the laminate. Really house and so it will be very warm. Thought a pellet boiler first, but in it not to dry dry, but to live and may not need such a powerful installation. If you are still on the ventilation, the question is also the same - the house of the sip panels - Termos ... Need clean and fresh air. The more I read in the net, the more head goes around .... Air conditioning either would not hurt. And yesterday I forgot to say I want to put solar collector systems for water heating. In nete, they are praised as nightling forest ... Region moderate - Poltava. Ukraine…. Sorry if straining. Thank you

Well, fame, just like me in youth. All something like I wanted to do. Well, advise something like that, but I will share the observations again.

1. Warm floor and laminate. In principle, it is possible: a) if the black floor is concrete, then you can pipe in the screed, then the bulk floor, and the laminate on the substrate; b) Black floor wooden on the lags, on it to Phaneur, reflector, infrared film and laminate.

As for infrared heating, I have already spoken, now about water and laminate. Laminate is now of course steep, but still, on a warm floor, it dissolves in time. The second problem is the mobility of the laminate. Even without warm floors, he is damn moving. Expands and narrows even without warm floors, depending on the external temperature. No wonder when laying it is necessary to make compensatory seams along the walls and under the thresholds.

With warm floors, he narrows the infection so that somewhere it will come out of the plinth.
Try to breathe about a warm plinth. There is such a heating system. I myself did not do, but I saw in the work - I liked it. All of the above problems removes. How to insulate the floors to be comfortable - it will be possible to talk separately.

About boilers with various know-how. I perfectly divide the desire to become independent of gas. Prices are growing, the quality of the horseradish, the smell, politicians wearing hands on it, in general, there are enough reasons. But which way to dig in search of the solution? Let's think.

I, because of older age, I remember well how the steam heating appeared. It seems that everyone was heated with furnaces and firewood, and suddenly, during a couple of years, he poned dutch with boilers, conducted pipes with batteries, and moved to the horsepope for coal, and not for firewood.

The locksmith plumbing became the most important man, the most important only secretary of the Central Committee of the CPSU, and healed perfectly, forgetting about simple furnaces. Twenty years lived without problems, and here gas appeared. So what? The year is two, and everyone has gas boilers, although it was very expensive at that time. Nothing, podnapped and switched to gas. Everything.

This is what I am. If something really standing appears, it does not need to look for or promote it. It smells like that worse, and it is nothing to stop. If some know-how, within a couple of years, did not disappoint what was before him, then you can safely put a cross.

Where do you come from good recommendations and reviews about them. Source, I think two. The first is those who invented them, and they sincerely admire their invention. But they are experimenting, and they are in the subject, and if something is wrong, they can quickly correct. We will scratch the turnip (and it happened with a halfway boiler). The second is the recently appeared as the edible class of marketers. I strongly suspect that they keep under control almost all construction forums. They have such a job.

About ventilation. In my opinion, you are wary in vain. What is a house from the sip panels? One floor, plus basement is possible, well, and the maximum attic, but there is a separate topic.

Hood is needed only in smelly rooms (toilet, kitchen). I do not know which and where the boiler will be, but if with a burner, it will be simultaneously with a powerful hood. So riser on three channels. The rooms are quite enough for vents, and the gaps in a couple of centimeters under the door cloth.

You can, of course you can dig about the congregation, but in my cottage village they were interlaced everything, but rarely enjoy. Someone caught up, someone is noisy. So hang. Anyway, after all, the air will not work in a litter.

The circulation in the house occurs constantly, somewhere warmer, somewhere is better, on one side the wind or the sun, with another shadow. This is not a multi-storey where all the windows are one way. The main thing is not to overlap this circulation.

And on the forums we turn out. Will say put the splinteen system, otherwise the cranes. They also need something to be expelled, and for this you need to beat the brains so that you boil.

By sunny systems I can really say anything - not exploited. The only advise to breathe on materials from which they are manufactured. I also say that the main element of the plate is silicon. Batteries are made from silicon oxide and another of his insinuations. There is a low price and a quick loss of efficiency.

In short, fight in this direction, and not only on the forums. It is better to find those who use such a system for more than three years, and talk live and touch their hands. My opinion - with solar batteries is bloated by another boom, promising huge sales and huge money.

In confirmation of this. My classmate is a firm's chief of autonomous energy supply. As I twist it, so that good solar batteries put me at the cottage. So no, I did not do anything. It hurts about them low opinion. And man lives this.

Will it probably enough? Run in the direction of the heating of our ancestors. In my opinion there is more chances to find rational grain.
But in general, most likely best result Dast a comprehensive solution. Just think it is necessary that and where to apply.

Hello!
Released from the situation. Where winding the warm walls shot down the plaster, they made the primer, the glue, the grid was attached to the grid. Foil did not fit, because the foil with a clutch clutch solution. Plaster with cement substitution solution up to 3 cm.
Heating - thermal pump. Cooling - heat pump through pipes on the walls.
Warm walls B. residential rooms, Warm floors - kitchen, bathrooms, hall.

Well done! I have a huge request. I have long known about heat pumps, but I have never happened to see the results of his work. Please remember about me in winter, and share observations. I will be very, very grateful. And not only me, many are interested in such an alternative gas.

uuu ... there is something to think about. Thank you so much…. I will think. Another month before the start of the epic named building .... If that with your permission will ask. Thanks again. You gave me a lot of food for reflection ... ..

You are welcome. Unfortunately, there is no universal solution for each specific case, so you have to think, to watch what others have to complain about and how to correct it. Look for examples of solutions in the availability zone (non-Internet), and communicate, recognize, compare. For example, I went around the new object of all the nearest tenants, I learned how much what they complain about, and what would have done differently. Interesting results are obtained. Everyone is pretending: but no matter how better. That one is good, the other does not suit. You draw conclusions - and forward.
It is difficult, of course, but then, with a good result, the whole life is heating a thought (I also reviews me), oh what a well done I am. And live more fun.
What about the comprehensive solution. Toilet bathroom and kitchen can be made on infrared radiation (cheap), for the hall - warm plinth and fireplace, as an addition, and beautiful, and living warm, and extract. For the bedrooms of water warm floor, for the constancy of temperature. It is like one of the options.

Hello! Thanks for the presentation of your experience. The picture of warm walls in my project is already beginning to be paid out. In the house that I build, the walls consist of pressed straw, which is covered with clay plaster. The pressed straw itself is poorly misses heat, therefore it does not plan to put a reflector, which also saw in other cases.
I still think about pipes. Metal plastic or stitched polyethylene. But nevertheless, I'm tending in favor of metalplastic, although I still did not finally decide. You pointed out the negative experience with cross-stitched polyethylene, I will be appreciated if you will tell you more.
And also interests the question of coincidence of temperature expansion. plastic pipes and plaster. And whether it is worth bothering this issue at all.
It is also interesting which collectors used, comprehensive. The reinforcement, did the temperature sensors, and the last, why do the pipes are recommended not higher than 90 cm from the floor?

So, first about the reflector. I think in your case it can be without it. As you correctly noticed, the main goal is to reduce the spread of heat towards the street.

The main thing is not even the foil itself, but an insulator under it. You have an insulator, it seems, and so ignited. Although there are discussions on infrequate radiation on the forums, which reflects the foil, but I have never found any data about what and how much of this radiation is generated by a metal-plastic tube. So all this from the category: "But Grisha said ...". Although many relate to this very seriously.

And further. Since the writing of the article, a lot of time passed, and now I am preparing a new post on environmentally friendly insulation for interior decoration. Your walls are just suitable for this category.

Even I will say more, if it were now so cannisitely, I would have changed the pipes for copper. Now there is increasingly information about how harmful in themselves all these pages, layers, ethylene and propylene. Especially those that work with high temperatures. Our Tolstos, whose houses I will service, are already shaky from them as from fever.

The ceilings stretched all squeezed, the plastic windows clarify on wooden, etc. Health cares. It's time for us about yourself and your families of your loved ones.

As for crosslined polyethylene, I unfortunately, or fortunately, I do not have experience. Just once for a long time, I got up question: what pipe to put? I then contacted good masterswho had such an experience with the supplier of Santeh. The influence, the dog eating in this matter, and as their five fingers know where which of what and how it makes almost everything connected with the plumbing, and received the answers that metalplastic in all respects is better.

In details, I did not go into details, because I considered that over time I find out everything myself, but I did not happen.

What about temperature expansion, you can not bother. Never of this question, as for water warm floors, did not give a reason to think about it.

About fittings. Tueva manufacturers a bunch. If possible - take Italian or Finnish, Valtec, Henko. From ours, I basically recommend SANMIX. Probably there are others, but I prefer it. Yes, and the supplier that I wrote above, recommended him.

I did not put temperature sensors, but removed. Almost everywhere where they were installed. They work if antifreeze in the system. If our tough flaming, or chlorinated water, then the sensor is bent in it or starts to rush.

Pipes can be placed above, just what is the point in this? Heat goes up. Well, if on the simple - batteries, too, do not rise above 90 cm. Below - yes, but I have not met above.

Yes, one more thing. Let's return to the beginning, to the isolator. Once you do not plan it, you trace it, so that the heat does not go inside the wall, it is me about cracks in the plaster, which will be attached to the pipe. If the heat leaning into such a crack, then condensate can be formed in the wall, with all negative consequences.

Thought once again above the reflector. Also remembered the proverb: "It is better to charge than to undepended." I have not found such heating experience in the exploitation of such heating. However, I know exactly that straw has two large enemy - rodents and humidity. From the first I use comprehensive protection. From the second, the main protection is plaster on all sides, which should dry before the onset of frosts. But if it does not dry or in the wall, an increased humidity will be maintained in a wall, perhaps, the appearance of condensate upon penetration of heat into the wall. I decided to sharpen a reflector from aluminum foil to the plaster grid into the heating project. I think it will not really hurt. The only thing that he browshes the possibility of passing the air in the place where it will be laid.
Next, began to study metal-plastic pipes. I went to the store and was surprised. Splitting prices for a pipe with a diameter of 16 mm is in the range of about 20 to 100 rubles per meter. Those. There is a difference of 5 or more times. I tried to find a review of metal plastic on the Internet and did not find what interests. It is mainly a comparison of metal plastic, polyethylene and polypropylene. Therefore, I do not know which of the pipes to choose and is there really such a fundamental difference may be in quality. Whether the plastic itself is different, or the glue. If this question is really relevant, then how to choose a metal-plastic tube is not entirely clear.
And once again about 90 cm. Ordinary heating is high temperature. Now the mention of low-temperature heating is becoming increasingly. Allegedly it is more comfortable and provides a smaller temperature difference in the plaster itself. So, with a decrease in temperature, the area of \u200b\u200bheated area increases. Someone says that the entire height of the wall is needed, someone to the height of human growth. But as always, more interested in not what they say and the real experience that is laid out is not enough.

What about the reflector. At the end of the past comment, I thought about the same thing about what and you. Clay can crack from drying out, and warmly will go to the wall. Foil is good, but honestly, I find it difficult to say something for sure. Painfully construction material You do not have standard. Most likely, after a while, you will become the first one, or one of the few who can accurately answer all the questions that are now standing in front of us.

I lived in a house of such a material in a distant youth, whole year, in Streys, but then my wife and I got a Russian oven. And what happens with the walls, I somehow did not interest. I can't even imagine what clay plaster is.

Or maybe it is better to keep it on the plaster grid, galvanized? Foil, of course, only plus.

About the pipe. Also for everything I will not say. Lemen and Kalde - do not take uniquely. He had a "pleasure" to see how the first cracks, and the second is separated. And all because Turkish Kalde, began to apply Chinese glue, and the pipe went not that. Take Sanmix. I recently worked only with him. The average price, and Zicher did not notice.

What about the height of styling the pipe and experience. I happened to do into the wall in three cottages. I did under the windowsill in 6 threads (alone with aide on the windowsill, and 5 entirely on the wall). In one more, the pool did so, the one in the article. In the rooms everything is fine and comfortable, and the pool is not yet running. Heating I experienced - heats, but until they use them. Only warm floors work.

And still such a thought about the laying height. Much more often made heating with warm floors, without walls. Zero height. The result is excellent. The main thing here is to hold the ceiling.

Hello everyone. Finished the repair and now decided to put heating radiators (centralized heating). Buy friends advise in the installine. I choose between aluminum and steel panels, immediately ask not to be clever about Bimetal and cast iron, I know without you what is better, but the budget is limited and enough for steel or aluminum. Tell me someone put aluminum radiators Global in a centralized system, how do they behave? How much have worked?

Combly behave. As well as Monlan, Kalde, Tessen, Warmica, or Teplomir. Gaskets do not dry up, the service life is enough for your age. Easy to understand.

Thank you for the article! There was a question - whether it is not better not to loop the return on the same as the feed, so that you cannot deliver the system. Those. The downward section is short, because the risks are smaller, and it is easier to flow the water bubbles to the aircraft?

Good question. The air in the warm flooring system is a muluor piece. The answer to the question of looting or not, why and how to loop here.

Well, with air - if a traffic jam can be driven by a line. And the one that stands out from the water will be released in the boiler. If the boiler is without an autumn, then you have to break my head for the installation of the air vent.

There is no reason for the project. It's hard to advise.

Hello! I'm in the house from the sip panels make warm walls. Methods are different. In the same room - on the outer walls of the Penophol, the snake of the horizontal pipe, then on the frame of plasterboard. Now overboard -2. In the room +24. Pace. coolant 50 gr. Walls to the touch slightly warm. In another room - Penophol, and on it a straightfinder steel with a depth of 21mm. Pipes are laid in the grooves of the proflift. While no closed. Feels from the wall are much warmer than in the first room. The flow rate reduced almost to zero so that the pipes are slightly warm and that night is hot. I do not know while how it will work when it all closes. Of the advantages - light dry installation, heat transfer must be more on the vented material from the professional leaf, the drywall can be attached directly to the edges of the proflist.

Original solution with a straighteness. Thank you for sharing. Of course, the heat transfer will be much better with him, because with such a design, an air gap is removed, which forms a frame for drywall.

And it is convenient to sow.

The question is, whether the flow of coolant coolant is enough to remove air bubbles, or have to put a lifting room on each wall. If you do not put a lifting service and the air will be collected, how often you will have to drive a air plug, because uniform reinstalled heating.

The scheme that in the pictures works the second season. Recently launched. Air burst required. But this is, of course, not obligs for all cases.

Here a) should not be carried away by a large number of turns, b) if the area is large, then we divide the scheme into several contours, for example, in the room, that on the pictures three separate circuits of 54 META C) are not worth lifting the heated area above 1 m., Heat goes up, and warm the ceiling for nothing. You just need to break your head to make so that in the total number and length of the lines on the plane it turned out evenly.

Somehow a long time ago, in Hamam, where the outline is done on the entire wall, I used at the top point of the outlet valve for air under the hatch, but I never used it. This is in a high-rise building.

And once I had to disconnect the line from the collector to drive a tube from a warm floor. And although the boiler and the collector were on the floor below the contour, the traffic jam was drunk. Then, by the way, it turned out that the contour of this was with a fractured flooded tie. I reworked him. That's just reworking him.

And no particularly water warm floors are sinning. These radiators on Leningradka are well aware of the air well, and the contour does not slow down without fittings. By the way, the exhaust valve on the line is the fitting, which means the narrowing of the flow diameter by 50%.

Why I asked, at the acquaintances of the warm floor did representatives of the company Kan. Warm floor has a different level on the same floor and at the top point is installed air vents that periodically blend air, it turns out that the air is assembled although the system is sealed. Interestingly, the air vents were necessary to put it or they were embarrassed just in case, because it should be put on the fitting, but this is an excess resistance.

Yes, the air in the system is formed from the water itself, and it happens to give small trouble. But almost all modern boilers have an air vent in which air from the system is collected and periodically blends. If there is no self-slip, then you have to monitor the pressure and feed the system.

What about the need for additional airlighteners on the lines, it is difficult to say unequivocally. I, for example, for all my considerable practice put only once. No longer put, and there were no problems with air traffic jams. Once only tormented, but there the contour was made according to idiot, and with a crack in the pipe. In my opinion, there are more purely theoretical fears than practical trouble.

And the air vent at the top point of the circuit is not only an extra fitting, it is also a hatch, or what other is the edge to be hidden.

There are no antifreeze of these problems. There are only increased requirements for the quality of work.

Thanks for the information about your experience, the question - how to solve the question of air outlets from contours in the walls. Thanks again.

The question is of course interesting, and I kind of answered him. In the first time I made a valve under Luchkom, but I didn't take advantage of it. Now almost all the boilers are the airway system, and this problem does not exist at all.

True last year I had a traffic jam on the windowsill, and I didn't get used. I had to overlap everything except this highway until I went.

The only strain of the pressure of the boiler remains. As the air lures so that the pressure loses, but also this problem has almost no remained as in systems mainly antifreeze.

Well, in any collector there is a drain, through which you can drive any hint.

There are also supernic pribabambas to remove air from the systems, only I did not feel them, that is, I did not exploit and tell them nothing about them. While it was not particularly necessary in them.

Yes, I read and still think that the collector should be above the top point. Otherwise, there will be problems with convulsion, it will be necessary to call the masters. And in winter, of course, everyone gives everything, if only it was warm.
And what problems well and let the collector stand on top. It is even easier to serve.

It is definitely impossible to answer this question, since it is not always possible to make a collector above the highway. If the cottage is 2 to 3 floors, and the warm wall is located, for example, on the top. You can certainly come up with something, but it is nothing.

That system that is shown in the article is collected in the 13th year, and after launching problems with air traffic jams, there was no collector at the level of the middle of the contour. Here, with balancing, it was impected at the beginning, since warm floors are still sitting on the collector, several contours and they are below the collector. I had to register to align heat distribution.

Good day! Thank you very much, for good disclosure! But there are questions. How to calculate the desired area of \u200b\u200bwarm walls? Or do the maximum possible to a height of one meter, and then adjust the circuit crane? What turns out in kilodates then the square of such a wall? Do not let her for a wardrobe.
Is the inner wall of the foam (30 centimeters of the gas chamber)? Will there be an adjacent room or a waste of heat?
Source data: Room 5.3 at 3.5 (height 2.6) One large inner wall.

Thanks for the feedback Alexander. As for the issues, it is not surprising that they remained, because each room and structure has its own characteristics in the design, in the location and size of windows and doors, heating protection and even the requirements of the inhabitants to comfortable in their opinion indoor temperature. Therefore, final decisions are accepted directly at the place of arrangement.

My article is only one of the many possible options. However, I will share some considerations with pleasure, although I repeat - the final decision for you.

As for kilowatts, it's not difficult in Google to find ways to calculate this indicator for any coolant, but the question is - how many of these kilowatt will need to be comfortable in your room?

Of course, you can contact specialists, and they will produce all measurements and calculations for good money and make up a project, assuring that in the future all costs will pay off. Most likely this (theoretically, t. In practice, I did not check), but it does not always roll it with us. Can mentality, maybe the lack of funds - I do not know. Therefore, in such cases (without a project), I take a well-known indicator 4 P.M. Pipes per square meter by floor. And from this calculation I plan contours. What to the floor, that in the wall.

Balancing, i.e. The adjustment of the valves to engage in this way and so will have. In systems where more than one line can not do without it.

Behind the wardrobe is also an interesting question. If the wall behind it is cold, it may make sense to provide at least some heated in inside. Well, let him go a couple of lines on the wall or by the floor, at least to prevent excessive moisture.

What about the inner walls. In fact, they can not be taken into account. If the necessary member is not recruited on the outside walls, the number of threads increases (in the plinth, in the window sills, a little higher), but if it does not work, it is probably better to put an insulator. Why warm 30 cm gas pack?

Although in practice it can do everything up to the opposite. The gasoblock warms and will ensure uniform heating of the room. But something does not lie to this soul solution. I can not explain. On the subconscious. Therefore, I will not say anything. Now the question is spinning: what will smell a heated aerated concrete?

Good day!
I apologize that my question is somewhat deviated from the topic marked in the article, but it seems to me that you are the person who can help me. Tell me, is it possible in an ordinary panel house where the heating pipes initially pass on the walls (there were such projects of houses in the late presentation times), put the heating of the valves on these same pipes? In winter, it is very hot, and the plumber working in the house says that it is impossible to cut the valves, because From this all the riser will overlap. But I do not have confidence in me to this plumbing (somehow he does not inspire confidence at all) - that's what I am interested in those who can be somehow in the subject. Thanks in advance, if you can prompt something!

Hello Tanya. Well, it is necessary. For the first time I hear about such a late Soviet project. Of course, you need to look at the place, but in theory, theoretically, if there is a riser, then it should be allotted by the type of batteries, (in your case it is most likely a pipe of smaller diameter) only hidden in the wall that can be put on the wall. The whole question is how difficult it is to do this, but you can only answer it again, looking at everything in place.

Good afternoon Vadim. It's just nothing to criticize. I will give only some thinners. The first is foil. There is no foil on the foofole in some microns thick. The fact that he does not remain and I had the opportunity to make sure. But once, looking more carefully to the fragments of the screed, I noticed that this spraying did not disappear completely, but just leaning out of the foam and left on the concrete. True, it was noticed by hard on large slices.

In general, I will not say anything categorically, but personally, I continue to use with a spraying, possibly for personal calm. In addition, the difference in the cost is so insignificant that practically nothing solves.

About the grid - I agree. What about grooves - generally wonderful. Why make layer plaster throughout the plane. Here is the savings. And at work and based on materials.

As for the foam, or isolon in the grooves - I would have laid. Considerations are: a) it will cost a penny, because only strips are needed in the grooves; b) will create depreciation for expansion-narrowing; c) isolates the pipe from possible fistulas in the masonry, the arbolites cannot be non-monolithic; d) a lot of little, but still will send heat inside the room.

I was glad to talk. I wish you all happen.

thank you. Arbolit is the monolithic, and about the depreciation, I'll think about

Why do you need a good reflector on the walls? If you heat the walls themselves, and not the air inside the house, then the house will not enter the cold air. Accordingly, the house will be warm. At the beginning of the construction, it was generally thought to be confused by laying pipes between clay blocks, but it was sooo long and expensive. I decided to make warm walls on top of both in the article, but without a reflector. But I'm not a special thing in this, I can be wrong. If it is wrong - correct.

In my case, the main function of the reflector or insulation is guaranteed protection against masonry defects. After all, inside the masonry necessarily plastering and the plaster closes all possible defects of its seams. Plastering twice - to contour. And after it is consumed and time consuming, so it is probably better to close the contour from the laying by the insulation, and then it is to launch everything. Reflector, by the way not obligs. In this case, from which the pictures in the article, it was the condition of the owner, and in my deep conviction, quite simply any sheet insulation.

And the pipes with the coolant must be close from the street. The wall towards the street is not only useless, but also dangerous. Condensate can be formed in the cold, which will not lead to anything good.

Thank you, Master, everything explained everything. Now I will know how best to make warm walls.

Good day. Is it possible to make water warm floor in a house with wooden floors? House carcass, wooden floor lags 200N100.

Great Timur. Cannient this case will be a water warm floor wooden floors. Unless of course, to take a maximum of ingenuity - then any business on the shoulder, but ... ???. All against this: a) the tree has a very low thermal conductivity and put the pipe under the board - money on the wind, b) the tree is movable and from good heating in the floor will appear solid gaps, c) to make the floor tie on the boards - everything cracks and crouples. Dry screed for TP is not suitable - the pipe will drown in the ceramzite and again money on the wind.

In general, we have a country of home geniine sequins and 100% somewhere on the forums can be found not one and not two craftsmen who have made water TP on wooden floors and are happy to share their decisions and observations. I have never done such a design and did not see someone did, so I can only assume how it will behave. And the assumptions often do not correspond to practice.

Good day!
I make repairs in the bathroom, which has an external wall with a window, under which the radiator had previously stood, but in the last repair it was abolished, which is why in the bathroom in winter Dubak. I plan to make a "warm wall". The carrier wall itself will close the plasterboard. Tell me, what should be a sandwich from the insulation, pipes, and maybe something else so that in the bathroom it became warm?

Kind. You Vadim suggests the option easier than the warm wall, and no less effective. Since you are planning a plasterboard, put heat insulation under it, well, as usual, and under the window, leave, or correctly, make a niche in the drywall, and install the radiator again in it. It will be whatever in the wall of the plasterboard, and it will look normally. On the wall itself behind the radiator in a niche, put a foam with a reflector, and everything will be ok.

And the contour under the plasterboard is unprofitable. 1. The area will devour. After all, there will be thermal insulation on the wall, at least a centimeter, if something like a foam, then a pipe - 2 more with fasteners, then the frame - 3 cm, then drywall - at least 1 cm. Total: 7 cm. And this is in The ideal, in fact it will turn out all 10. 2. Between the pipe and plasterboard, thanks to the frame there will be an air layer in 3 cm, and the air is an excellent heat insulator. Of course, it will be warm, but the effectiveness will be much lower than that of the pipe in the plaster.

Why don't you want to do as shown in the article? Thickness is 5 cm. If you have a wall area not big, then the thing is that it is necessary.

Good all day.
Tell all the minutes to my offer.
I have been planning on the 1st floor of a warm floor everywhere, on the 2nd warm walls, because Floor wooden, house insulated 100mm foam, windows with 3 layer glass.
I want to take a 2-circuit condensation boiler, under the "warm floors" it is low-temperature.
I understand it is necessary to put 2 collectors, one on the floor. Well, with warm floors, it is clear, on the draft floor a waterproofer (film), from above 80 mm of extrusion polystyrene foam, metal .set, pipes, all pour cement-sandy solution with plasticizers and tiles.
But on the second floor I think simply let 4-5 contours of the pipe along the inner perimeter of the house, alternating the reverse flow from left to right, and then launch a cement-sandy solution with a plasticizer.
Did I completely conceived? Waiting for comments, and grateful for them in advance.
P.Z. I am in the south of Ukraine, the winter is short-lived and relatively warm.

Good day!
I plan to build a house in 2 floors + heated basement from a monolithic ceramzite concrete 30 cm + facing brick (In Ulyanovsk, in my opinion, for the eyes of such a wall). The overlap of the first floor is planning to pour the ceramzite concrete 0.15. Is it possible to lay a warm floor and walls before the fill, if possible, how to implement it? Thanks in advance for the answer and for your site.

In my opinion, Victor is all right. I think a little bit down with the penplex on the first floor. And 50 for the eyes, even in Tatarstan, and all the more. What is 50. That's just last year a neighbor was made to a hairdresser (business wife). On the ottump of the ceramzite concrete, Pleepoplex 30-ka and TP. Not a reservoir is noticed, no uncomfortable room temperature. Bear in mind. And for the rest you think correctly.

Good afternoon Dmitry. Just the soul rejoices that people began to build again. And then the straight "dead season" was.

On your question. Wall thickness ok! But to immediately build down the heating highways - I think it will be even. Not in the sense that it is difficult to make the installation itself, but that the wiring will be interpreted in the production of other works. In this stage, it will be not only in the floor and the wall in this stage, there will also be seeding sections to the boiler.

Of course, I do not know all the nuances of your project, and I present at your own sight. After all, when pouring, it will have to jump on the reinforcement and between it, and if the contour pipe will still be on top. No matter how to damage.

And one more nuance peculiar to our people - smart thoughts comes apart. And he built, and others, well, everything seems to be planned, and it's noted, as it fulfills the work, it has repeatedly started: "Eh, here it was not necessary to do this." As it were, it did not come out with TP. How the walls and draft floors will be ready, no matter how a more successful location and liner layout occurred.

In short, theoretically possible. You can podnaping, to calculate everything, bring everything into zero, or close to it, calculate the depth of the pipe laying and make. But how it will be done in practice .... ??? I did not do it.

Good day. We want to insulate the hallway. The hallway is about 12 sq.m. And there is not a single radiator. Winter is pretty cold. Especially cold goes from the entrance. Did not make a warm floor initially, now regret. I don't want to raise the tile. Thought to install the radiator - not aesthetically and there's nowhere to be in essence. Thought about warm water walls. I am trying to find information about laying pipes in the wall. The wall is approximately 1 meter 30 cm. Thickness is about 10 cm - the thickness of a silicate brick (I hope the name wrote the right, light brick). The wall is also not the option, it means to pave the shoes. What will not be thermal insulation is not scary, heat will go to another room.
When using strokes will have to increase the thickness of the wall. Perhaps this is avoided? Or 10 cm thickness is not enough? Plaster plaster on the walls.
thanks for the advice

Good afternoon Vasily. 10 cm. For an eye for eyes. It is enough to make a 5 cm short. Contour and strip of thermal insulation are freely fit. It will be even so much insulation, how much ammortizer to expand the pipe.

The problem is in the sealing of the shoes. If it is easy to dress, then she gives a crack. I even tried it in two receptions to close it and primed everything that is possible, but still the crash appeared. And as soon as I put a strip of the foam in the stroke, so everything is no cracks. But still close in two receptions and the soil and the stroke itself and the first layer.

The grid in this case is not necessary, so the wall thickness does not increase. That's just the stroke should be taken carefully, so as not to go cracked on the wall in the next room. It happened that they appeared. We had to repair.

Hello, the situation is. Connected loggia with room. The radiator remained on a piece of wall under the window (the window and the door to the loggia naturally removed). Made a warm electric floor on the loggia itself, the balcony was glazed. But insulated how little seems to me. The outer wall (railway plate under the outer window) from the inside was insulated with 8 cm extruded polystyrene and 1 cm foil foam polyethylene. Stitched plasterboard. The wall itself is not cold, but under the window sill and immediately on top of it clearly goes cold. Here I think to remove the plasterboard, and make a water "floor" behind him. Height of about 70 cm, wall width 2.4 m.
I would like your opinion, what pipes to do, and whether the effect will be.
Thank you.

Good evening Vladimir. In your situation, another solution suggests. Remove the windowsill and immediately become clear what is there. Most likely the frame is not propivered, therefore it pulls the cold.

Put the frame and the windowsill is not difficult. Correct this shorter, as it will still pull the cold with her, and even then, by the result, decide whether heating is needed in the wall.

In fact, the water warm floor is assumed to be plaster, since in it and the heat transfer surface is greater, and thermal conductivity is higher than when mounting under plasterboard.

In the walls of tinted drywall, a niche is usually made in which the radiator is installed.

Hello. Very interesting your experience. I want to make heating only with warm walls. There are a few questions. What if instead of mp. Pipes to use steel 25 or 32mm, mounted by its horizontal snake in a concrete wall niches with a slope and with the upper feed. Will the EC be present, because. There are interruptions with electricity? The height will be up to the windowsill 95 cm, four threads, the length of the circuit is 70 meters. Does there be heat transfer such a wall? Outside there will be a wave of 5 cm Epps. Moroza we have up to -40.

Good afternoon Victor. Sorry delayed the answer, work is full, do not have time.

In fact, with my metal I have no experience. Once attended when copper did. And he himself is always only p / n and metalplastic.

I think I think. What about feeding without pump - the case is risky. First, you need to look at the place and estimate a slope. From the boiler and throughout the system. And secondly, the diameters of the pipe and the distribution system, the contour is probably not one. Well, this is actually everything is solved.

About metal. Him after all, what the plaster is not put. He has an expansion more than in plastic, and corrosion. Do not know how it rotes, dissatisfies is in question, but with further decoration it will be necessary to provide the appearance of rust spots.

With small points (well, there the armature is close to the outdoor, or what nail in the seam of the masonry is made yes they are attached) just, and there is a whole contour.

If, of course, to immediately cry, but also how paint under the plaster does not save, until the plaster dries?

In short, you can see - the heads above the roof. Do better plastic. Stainless steel with copper expensive.

There is enough, it is not enough, it will not depend on the contour and frosts, but from the heat-power of the structure. If the floors of the walls of the wall and the windows-doors are well kept, then as it is not enough, of course it is enough. Calculation for Metalplastic D16: 4 P.M. per 1 sq.m. Room area. And you have D25, yes 70 m. This is at least 26 squares.

Sorry, I supposedly loaded. But think. Without it in any way.

Hello. A problem with outer wall In the end apartment, the temperature of the wall is 14 to 18 degrees, the house is a new brick five-storey. Since in the apartment 3 walls outdoor, they cooled the whole apartment, the batteries do not cope. Is it possible to solve this problem with the installation of pipes into the wall and how best to do it.

This is really the Ivan problem. But it is most likely not to solve the contour to the wall. First, on such a long outline (3 walls) you will have to put a pump, and then you will noticeably take the heat from the neighbors. The scandal may turn out.

I came across such a situation several times. In two cases, the apartment was insulated. Those weathered with plasterboard with insulation, drywall in 2 layers, insulation, too, in 2 layers of 5 cm. Batteries remain in niches. It turns out normally, and heat (communicate with the owners so far), but eats the area.

Once, one owner hired prom. climbers, and they were insulated outside. Also did carefully, but as there I could not say there.

Sergey, welcome! With a new-fashioned system "Warm Plinth" accidentally did not come across? Reviews are positive, on the forumhouse there are even attempts to promise homemade structures (the topic "Warm plinth (water) - Made in the Russian Federation" is done with their own hands "). If it came across, how do this system characterize: fashionable phenka or a clear thing?

Forumgus rarely go, time is missing. About the system heard the reviews are accurately positive. And Kustarno, I will do so well. After all, I have floors on the bottom of the cut, so that the main outline in the corners do not bend under 90 degrees, I decided to put extra. How to issue has not yet thought, but I will think of something. And so the pipe is cool under the log will go.

As I will run, then accurately characterize.

Clear. People have already tried to make self-optical options on the forumhouse, the name of the appropriate topic has already led. It turns out. He himself caught fire with this plinth as an additional heat source already launched a warm floor. That's just did not decide whether the plinth was industrial or self-made. Industrial for the price is very biting. Good luck!

We will do. I'm still waiting for a branded to work. Well, to hold in your hands, "sniff-smuggling."

And the forumhouse will look like. I have several bookmarks from there. By autonomy, I am on the island to be built, and on the dryness - the Kelo.

Where is it? I know only the island of Sviyazhsk. From dry pine?

Sviyazhsk is a Civil Island. I have a green boron. Islands island, but there is no joy of NTP on it. Electricity - generator and solar panels, heating - firewood. But Nature is virgin and seats Pts. lot.

Sustained pine, suitable for a log, is obtained only in northern forests. Called Kelo. Everything I want to ride yes to touch her with my hands, "smooth-sniffing." Expensive.

Hello! We have an angular apartment, we are going to warm the wall with a "water warm floor". Is it possible to hang on the wall and close with plasterboard? Or require reflector and better just to launch? There will be no mold at the same time, is it good to keep the wallpaper on a warm wall?

Hypzart, Zhenya, there is also a framework. That is, the pipe will be 3 cm. From the drywall. And this means that at first it will warm the space between the wall and plasterboard, then the plasterboard itself, which will already give heat into the room.

What happens I do not know, as I have never done that.

Wallpaper also never did on the warm walls. Or tile, or stucco under painting.

Mold appears where bad ventilation and dampness. Warm walls are usually very dry.

Good day. Need consultation. There is a project of heating. Heating is provided only by TP. I'm afraid that's what. Walls thick, as the result of the windowsill width of 500 mm. Two windows in a wet zone are one in the bathroom, another in the kitchen, where the sink is opposite the window. I'm afraid of condensate, there are no radiators. There was a thought to start a loop from TP under the windowsill. It is clear that the windowsill will be a stone or tile. I'm afraid of the air traffic jam. Or can you solve this problem with the placement of the collector with the hinges of the TP, to which the heated windowsill will be connected above the level of these window sills? At the collector, there will be an automatic airier. Does this scheme have the right to life? Or there are simpler and ready solutions? I will be grateful for the answer.

Hello Vladislav. The host of the pool, which is shown in the article, were exactly the same concerns about the contour of the windowsides. Just one-in-one.
As a result, they agreed that I brought him out the contour in those. The room, made an open loop there above the windowsill levels and returned the reverse again along the windowsill on the collector, which is located below the level of the windowsill.

Agreed that if a traffic jam (his assumption) is formed, I will cut a loop at the top and put an airier there. Immediately put it categorically refused - I can't stand fittings in contours.

Three years have passed since then - the airier has not needed. Baccick properly collects air out of the entire system and, if necessary, whips (the same auto industry, only built into the boiler).

By the way, all the windowsills and the first floor TP are sitting on the same collector (pool and boilers with collectors in the semi-oiled) and everything is fine. I almost did not bother with balancing. So, a little bit undergoing TP semi-oiled and that's it.

Yes, more. Before starting each line, you need to fill it with its coolant. Those. You leave the reverse not connected (above the bucket), open the feed and as soon as it rinsing, you close the feed. Vacuum will not give the coolant to flow and connect the reverse to the collector.

The amount of air that falls into the system is not able to form a plug, and will be removed by the boiler. It is only necessary to follow the operating pressure and sign the system.

Hello Master. I am so saying your colleague from the city of Perm, I have been doing since 2006. I also want to open my site, so I decided to see how people work on the Internet. I read your answers everything is written very competently, there is now what to be equal to anyone. The only thing is not clear why you do not work with stitched polyethylene. The material is simply great and has no equal (this is personally my opinion). One of the main advantages is very difficult to damage when installing. On laid hinges, you can safely walk, the chances are not afraid (it is enough to warm the scene of the hall and he takes the initial shape). I use it in the warm floors and the walls of 5 years old already and there are no complaints, according to fittings (if the sealing ring does not lift when the sealing ring) did not see it to be fled. I use the fittings usual from the metal plate (GF, VALTEK), the pipe is also mostly Valtek if the client insists, then RexAu (but it seems a special sense-stittle in Africa). In general, I advise you to try, the main thing is not to take cheap fakes (there may be an ordinary PND). Good luck in our not easy and good customers.

Thank you by Volodya. With stitched polyethylene, somehow did not work out. At first, someone responded dismissively, so I treated him, and I did not work myself, and the clientele did not insist.

And now I am rarely working, 57 already. More and more I observe what has already been done, but small repairs, the service is shorter. Yes, here two sites lead. Come in https://starper55plys.ru, it is just on the website building and site management.

If you suddenly bring to work, of course, I will definitely move the article, I will describe the impressions.

Hello! I have a question about heat loss, the Weso insulation laid the metapol pipe, the gasket fooled between the plaster and the insulation did not put, the space where the pipes were laid, proppidented adhesive foam for foam. The top will be centimeter plaster on cement and laying mosaic. Doubts about the account that I did not put a foil gasket and warmly will go on the wall or still not obligatory foil and heated insulation will be good?

Do not bother on foil. In the plaster from her sense a little. There is an opinion that it reflects infrared radiation. But no one bothered this radiation, and talk at the level of rumors. Put - well, do not put - either not bad.

Good day. There are 3 bedroom apartment 2 rooms for children bordered with temperature seams, cold walls. I want to insulate them with warm walls. The apartment has a 2-contour boiler. If you take the flow that goes on the battery, it will not be possible that the last battery will be cold until the water comes on the walls, cool? I am going to lay in 3 threads 30 cm between them, the total length of the system will increase by 30 m, approximately. What then can be separated by the wall, if the wallpaper is impossible? Thank you for the idea.

Good evening Yuri. The contour must be made with a separate thread. This is a lot of reasons, so take as proper. Under the boiler or somewhere near the boiler to make a collector for two pairs, one on the battery, one on the contour.

The finish can be done under painting. Simple, Venetian, etc. Now such good prudes pond.

Hello.
Help, please understand the example.
The room has dimensions of 5 x 4 m, the floor area is 20 m2. If we proceed from the proportion of 4 pm Pipes for 1 m2 by floor, this room requires 80 perm. Pipes lay in the walls. The room has two outer walls, two internal. Suppose that all the external walls will be warm. Then it is necessary to 80 pm. / (5 + 4) \u003d 9 threads on the wall. Considering that there should be 20-30 cm between threads, above 1 m from the floor is not rational, and there are windows in the walls, then such an alignment looks erroneous.
It turns out that warm should do all the walls - both external and internal. Then the threads will need only 4 or 5. It seems good, but the room has doors, wardrobes, bed, table. And the height of the warm walls should be 6-7 threads. And again in the window rests, they begin with 80 cm from the floor.
On the planning, it is quite possible to make 4 threads of heating on the external walls. It is about 50% of the necessary reimbursement of heat loss. The rest will have to get radiators in particularly cold months.
But then the heating system is harder, layer of plaster thicker, more.
Savings at the construction stage does not smell, it remains only to expect that such a scheme will be comfortable in operation.
I understand everything correctly, I have not mistaken anywhere?
And another question. It often comes across such a phrase: on the first floor he is heated with warm floors, on the second - radiators. What is the reason for such discrimination of the second floor?
Or ask differently - is it practical to do warm floors and / or walls on the second floor in a private house?

P.S. House of warm ceramics, Moscow region.

Good evening Alexander. I understand what you want perfect option Heating. Everybody wants. And it is right. Only the most ideal option is selected from the totality of technical and creative solutions and compromises. You see what the mistake in your message is not a creative component. And without compromise, it is not enough here.

First 25 cm between threads - optimally, but not only in any way differently. You can and smaller, 15 - 20. Under the windows can be narrowed. According to the outer walls of the threads is greater and tight, on the inner less and wider, that is, to stretch from the perimeter, then wrap it only on the outer wall.

If there are a lot of furniture on the walls, then it is better not to do warmly at all. One thread on windowsill with a return over the windows, the rest in the floors. By the way, the Combi floors in my best option, just need to think that where and how much, respectively, layout, and alleged exploitation. You have a total length, Skinte how to distribute.

More, 80 m contour on the walls - after. At a minimum one must be divided into two contours. This can be turned on the floor on the floor, and in the walls of the contour is narrow and long. I can not shine with the figures of the warmth, but in practice I remember that 50 m. - It is already exemplary. Although I did, but there was also a swimming pool and a combine wall-heated water-heating of air. In short, for each specific case, it is necessary to proceed from specific conditions. Well, of course compromise ease cost. Something more due to the fact that something smaller. Also very individually. There is still a factor - the calm of the soul. Do you understand yes? Many come to additional costs, if only it was calm.

On warm floors on the second floor, someone can say something, only here I live only with warm floors on two floors and no problems (the first floor of the brick + grainsit, the second log house), although for the calm of the soul made spare Couples, which would be the case with a line for radiators. And I bought radiators, still lying. That's how.

I do not know if my answer will help you, but such a thing that is that the construction is that the repair: you will hope for uncle - the risk of getting the problems for your own money, you will do it yourself - you will have to straighten the limit, learn, think, estimate, decide.

If what, write.

Thanks for such an unfolded and fast reply. Gone to read, count, decide. Therefore, fell out of communication. The crossroads did not leave, standing in thought. Thanks again.

P.S.
It turns out that I am not one who wants the perfect scheme ...

So it is quite normal!

Warm electric walls have recently begun to gain popularity. Although this is not a massive phenomenon, but wishing becomes more and more. After all, many want to save on heating and choose the best options.

For such heating, several options can be used, and we will consider them today. Also on the video in this article and the photo it will be possible to receive additional information that will be extremely useful.

Possible options for warm walls

Warm electric walls can be made in different versions. Technically, the heat source and carrier should be here, which is warmly distributed on the wall plane. What is evenly.

ATTENTION: Before making the purchase of equipment for a start, we must all thoroughly weighed. After all, the price will not be small. Therefore, it is necessary to understand how much this option is beneficial.

Pros and cons

Among the minuses of the housing insulation using electricity, it is worth noting the following points:

1. Not the best heat exchange. This is due to the fact that the heating component is inside the wall, and heat, before it turns out to be in the heated room, it is necessary to get through the plastering trim or a drywall sheet (see the walls of the walls with plasterboard sheets in different ways). At the same time, only space is heated within twenty centimeters from the wall, and warm air immediately rises up, without having warmed the entire room. As a result, it becomes necessary to install an additional electric heating device.
2. The wall is no longer installing a closet or a servant, any household electrical appliances. The furniture will dry, and the devices are heated. Book shelves hosted on chapted places (see Wooden Shelves: What to choose), refrigerator, washing machine, TV will reduce the heating of the room, and the heat exposure is not the best way It will affect the safety of furniture, which will slowly dispel and crack. In addition, electrical devices can simply overheat
3. Large heat losses, which will be directed not only inside the rooms, but also outside, outside the house. The lining under the infrared tissue of foil thermal insulation will only lead to the fact that the effectiveness of the heating of the room will simply decrease.
4. Reducing the possibility of using walls as holding surfaces. Drill and hang on the wall picture, carpets, clocks, the TV will no longer work, if the installation of a warm floor will not be pre-installed for items for all occasions.
5. The most serious disadvantage of electrical heating in the walls is considered to accumulate condensate in the space between the cold surface of the wall and warm (see the walls of the wall: what can be the reason). The dew point shifts to the internal component. Laying the electrical cable inside the wall leads to the point of dew, the middle of the wall becomes, and not the external part of it, as it happens with ordinary walls. As a result, the wall will begin to thoroughly collapse more quickly. Plus, for fungus and molds, just ideal conditions for active breeding will arise.
6. Rising cash flows for electric power consumption. Even if the laying of the heating cable vertically will be made with a large distance between its bends, the consumption of electrical energy in any case will increase much. Will it become really warmer - a big question.
7. The deadline of the decoration wall decreases greatly, and, most importantly, she will lose their appeal.

The electrical heating of the vertical surfaces of the room does not guarantee that, after a certain number of weeks or months, the wallpaper will not dug in the apartment. Wallpapers can be discarded and faster, due to the fact that when installing a warm floor, the adhesive composition for tiles will be incorrectly selected, it does not matter in the kitchen or in the bathroom.

By the end of winter, the tile can fall off to the floor. It can happen even in the middle of the heating season. Well, if the walls are trimmed with plasterboard sheets or plastic (see finishing with plastic: Select panels).

It turns out that there are too many minuses of such a heating organization, and all of them will not please us. After studying many critical reviews of the Soviets on the Internet forums of people who collided with problems in improving the heating of the dwelling, we came to the conclusion that only two main advantages on the wall had a warm floor on the wall.

Namely:

1. Vertical internal heating of the room does not distribute dust in all rooms.
2. Since the heating elements are placed inside the panel, the space is added to the room.

Internal and wall-mounted water heating devices

Placed inside the wall or on the outer side of the wall of the pipe, are connected to the equipment of the housing equipment with heat. The main equipment, on which its work depends, is already there, with additional load it can cope easily.

It:

• Pipes themselves;
• Pumping unit;
• Distribution unit;
• Device supporting a constant temperature;
• Device determining temperature.
• Other automatic devices.

ATTENTION: Installation of hydraulic systems on the walls is most often carried out by the so-called "dry" method, using covering fixtures of fences in the form of dampers or panels, or a "wet" way, that is, before plastering.

Installation of instruments on the wall followed by their plaster is made gradually and includes the following steps:

1. Surface cleaning OT. old paint. and dirty spots and subsequent placement of electrical wiring with an electric circuit.
2. Installation, heated assembly, if it is not installed earlier.
3. The sticker of polystyrene foam and the coating of its necessary vapor barrier.
4. Strengthening the fasteners on which the pipeline is located. When installing inside the bathroom, the heating external system is permissible to continue beyond the boundaries of the wall. It can be used for drying towels and linen.
5. Zigzag Pipeline Placement. The distance between the zigzags of the pipe is determined independently. The main thing is that the Zmeevik managed the plots on which the installation of furniture accessories is planned.
6. Connecting the pipe to the mixing site.
7. Conducting pipes with pressure, one and a half times exceeding the usual.
8. Attaching reinforcing glass equipment.
9. Wall covering with a small film of plaster plaster.
10. Strengthening the thermal sensor.
11. Following when plaster dries, a lime-cement composition is applied to it. The size of this layer above the pipe should be no more than two or three centimeters. Otherwise, the plaster just cracks. In addition, too thick layer of the plastering mixture will prevent high-quality heat transfer.
12. Next follows the hardening of plaster thin grid before putty. Such a sequence of actions will prevent the formation of cracks when heating the wall.

The installation "dry" method for any systems is also occurring in stages:

1. The wall of the insulating and steam insulating substance, or polystyrene foam, or a foil foam film, is attached to the released and peeled on the old coatings.
2. Tires are attached to install the pipeline.
3. The pipeline is fixed, which is connected to the mixing cabinet. The mixer is checked.
4. The base is established from metal or bars.
5. The installation of the "warm wall" is completed by attachment to the base of trees fiberglass go drywall. No plates from other materials are not excluded.

Water mode of wall heating has its advantages. Unlike electrical heating, in the summer, in the heat, it serves to cool the room, replacing the air conditioner.

Modern cable heating system

Heating with electricity using electrocabels is considered to be quite economical, although you have to pay for electrical energy. Heating cables increase the temperature in the room, due to the passage of electrical current.

The following elements include the cable heating system:

• Single-core or two-housing heating cables or not too thick heating planes on which cables are placed.
• Automation, regulating the process of inclusion, heating and cessation of heat supply.
• Installation strips, corrugated pipe.
• Automation to turn off the system.

The installation of cable heating coated with plaster is similar to the installation of the heating system with water. The electrical cable is placed with an arbitrary removal from its subsequent bends, and is not placed where the furniture will stand and appliances. It is attached using installation devices.

• When installing warm electric walls, it is worth putting the thermal insulation material, although it is not necessary. The main concern during the installation of planes is not to be mistaken when they are cut by specified marking. The temperature sensor is not recommended to be installed next to the floor. It is better to place it inside the corrugated pipe.
• Plastering the wall is recommended when the equipment is turned off, and start using the system better month later.
• Installs the core under the plate or enclosing panels. Then the cable planes are mounted on the wall, instruments are installed, ensuring the activity of heating. The base is covered by plaster.
• It is worth noting that in addition to the electrical cable system, heating is also produced a heating means "warm plinth in different versions. This equipment is installed similarly to the electrical system. The main on the installation of "warm plinth" is the installation of automation that defines its operation, in accordance with the instruction. Device height Fifteen centimeters, attached "plinth" at the bottom of the walls. As a coolant used warm waterflowing through the tubes or electrical cable. This equipment is perfect. Installed in parallel to the coldest walls, it fills the room with heated air, the jet of which rose by the wall and create a comfortable microclimate in the apartment. The system does not create air flows that are transferred by housing dust.

Infrared heating devices

Infrared heating is considered the most in modern way Humming of dwellings:

• Installing its base elements is simple. Fast speed solving problems made this system popular. The planes with fixed rods made of graphite are placed on the wall like previous wall heating systems. It is possible to cover with plaster or frame-laying. The film option is mounted even easier. It is simply glued to the surface with special glue.
• But it is worth noting that with film infrared heating systems do not provide for the simultaneous use of vapor or heat insulation from aluminum made. In addition, infrared film canvas is not covered by plaster. Also, adhesive compositions for tiles are also contraindicated. Such systems are installed only "dry" Wall coating. Connection according to the instructions.

Stages of work:

1. Cleaning the surface to which equipment will be installed.
2. Laying the heat dissolor.
3. Survection of the surface by bars, which are necessary for the installation of plasterboard sheets.
4. Attaching the plates to the surface.
5. Isolation of a special special means along the edges of the cuts.
6. Mounting the thermoregulation device and thermal sensor.
7. Checking the functioning of the system.

Electric warm walls do entirely. And do it yourself. And the choice to do you and the instruction will help you this question.

In this article, we will analyze in detail all stages of installation of water warm walls and gender. What is water warm walls and floors? This is the so-called heating system with heated water circulating. Before starting the installation of walls, a newcomer in this business must be seized by elementary theoretical knowledge. Then you can also start directly to practical activity.

After reading the article, you will learn a competent approach to work. You can directly proceed to step by step making wall mounting. You will also learn certain nuances when conducting mounting work. Thus, the knowledge gained will allow you or start assembling yourself. watery warm walls, Or completely able to direct and control the work of specialists.

On the question of customers of installation work. Quite often, the warm water walls and the floors of the bath owners are ordered, because the conditions of the environment in the steam room obliges well to warm the room. For example, in the Turkish Ban Hamam, the temperature of the floor and walls are maintained in the area of \u200b\u200b40 degrees, and air humidity is 100%. In the Russian bath, the optimal temperature of the walls is 60 degrees, with air humidity of 60%.

Preparation and insulation of walls

Consider an example of the installation of water warm walls and gender on the example of the bath with the above environmental parameters. First you need to decide on the location of the steam. The walls themselves do not have to be high. Naturally, a prerequisite for them is the perfectly smooth and attached surface. Thus, the use of a gas-silicate block will make it possible to achieve the desired result.

Thermal insulation panel is then made, but its mount should not be made from plastic material, since the estimated high temperature in the steam room can melt fasteners. The optimal option will "plant" the slab on a special foam. Moreover, apply the foam on the stove two times for better mounting and press the extruded polystyrene foam to the wall is also twice. Pre-wall is diverted by primer and treated with a waterproofing layer. As for the insulation of the floor, the difference from the insulation of the wall is that a polyethylene film is placed on top of the heat insulating panel of extruded polystyrene foam.

1. Just press to extruded polystyrene foam. Then there will be no gap between the grid and the polystyrene.
2. Attach the chemical dowel with two washers to achieve the presence of a distance between the grid and the polystyrene of about one centimeter. This will allow the pipe to be further from the wall, due to this better to warm the room. The chemical dowel must be applied if the wall masonry is based on a gas chamber (or foam block). In case the brick or other material is used, you can do as the attachment of conventional anchors. According to the technique of performing work it is more convenient to first cover the grid, then it is then secured.

Installation of pipes of warm walls

The next step is to install a warm wall pipe. Specialist, as well as a simple town man, is much more pleasant to work with a metal-plastic design. Since it bends without problems and takes the necessary form. The diameter of pipes should be about 16-20 millimeters. It is advisable to use pipe beg. If a specialist applies pipes from metal plastic, it is very easy to observe the necessary step between them. A variable step of laying pipelines of the warm wall system allows you to achieve a uniform distribution of heat in the room. Usually for this, on a plot of 1-1.2 meters from the floor, metalplastic pipes are stacked with a step of 10-15 centimeters; On the section 1.2-1.8 meters from the floor - the step increases to 20-25 centimeters, and above 1.8 meters - pitch of pipes about thirty, forty centimeters. At the same time, the direction of movement of the coolant is always taken from the floor to the ceiling. Special attention should be paid to the fact that pipe holdings are mounted smooth

When mounting pipes in the steam room, four contours are obtained - three on the walls and one on the floor. The optimal option is one outline on one wall. When external Wall Compensation of heat loss to the external environment will be made, in the case of a interroom wall - two rooms will be heated at once. The size of the contour depend on the area of \u200b\u200bthe room, it must go inextricably. It is advisable not to do frequent turns of the pipe for one hundred eighty degrees, since because of this, part of the heat will lose, as well as organize articulations. For each contour there is its feed and repetition pipe. On one of the walls it is necessary to leave a place for two floor pipes. The pipeline of the warm walls, leaving the limits of the steam, is better to isolate, so that the bathroom is not too hot in the recreation area, and also for the pipe to give less heat.

Pipe loops can be secured by any devices, the main thing is that they remain integer. For example, a straight suspension is taken, it is twisted with a suitable way and twisted into the dowel installed in the wall. In places where pipes will pass through the corner of the room, it is recommended to make a deepening in advance, thereby increasing the rotation radius. Otherwise, it can be an angle to be twisted, or a warm wall tube will be visible.

"Filling" of warm walls

Further, the second layer of the MAC grid is attached to the already installed pipes. The second layer of the mesh is necessary in order to be better distributed heat and the solution was well. To start the fill with concrete is required from the floor, letting it well frost (in time it takes one week, a maximum of ten days). Then take it for the warm walls - to set a formwork at a distance of three centimeters from the pipe. After laying a concrete after the wall. Well, of course, to launch, and put on top ceramic tiles. Warm walls and floors are ready!

Thus, the installation of warm water walls is a fairly simple technology that does not require special costs of forces and applications. welding work or metal-cutting tools. Installation of warm walls is practically no different from floor heating systems. This design provides comfortable conditions for microclimate indoors, has a beneficial effect on health. And if desired, warm walls can be made with their own hands.

Today, the issue of maintaining heat in the house is very relevant. Exists a large number of various methods To save the heat in the house, for example, the inner or outer insulation of the walls, the installation of plastic windows, warm floors, or warm walls.

Warm walls are a rather promising type of heating that resembles a system of warm floors, however, in this case, the heating elements are installed in the walls. The heating elements used are similar: thermal cable or infrared radiation film, heating pipe wiring, divorce.

The heat emitted from the walls allows you to warm the air into the room evenly, while this effect is similar to the effect of heat emanating from the Sun, due to which the feeling of heat and comfort can be perceived at a relatively low air temperature, namely approximately 15-17 degrees. At the same time, it is permissible to use energy-saving technologies in the heating system, such as helium heating or capacitors.

For the human body, such a decreased air temperature is more favorable, as cool air is able to alleviate breathing and lift well-being. Such heating is also beneficial for the budget, since it consumes less energy to create comfortable conditions in the house.

However, the warm walls have some drawbacks:

• it is impossible to race the walls with furniture and hang carpets on them because they are heaters;
• if you drive into the wall of a nail if necessary, it can damage the heater itself. To do this, you need to make a detailed plan of communications when installing the system. At the same time, if heating films are used, it is categorically not allowed to hang on the walls of any items.

Rules for the use of warm walls

It is advisable to use the heating system of warm walls only in cases of having a large wall area, not closed objects. For example, in the children's room or in the living room you can use the "open" wall, converting it to the source of heat.

But in the balconies and on the balconies, a similar heating system will be less effective due to the small surface of the free wall. The identical result of small heating will be in case there is a large window opening on the wall, which will take a lot of heat, which dramatically falls the convection in the room, leading to uneven warming up space.

Those who know about the principle of warm floors, easily understand the technique of heating walls, which is completely identical to the warm floors. It does not require any additional knowledge and skills, rather, on the contrary, it can be said that the process of the warm wall of the warm walls is slightly degraded compared to the warmest floors. From the design of warm walls in most cases, such a part is removed as reflective thermal insulation, since the heating element with such a setting of the problem warms the wall, removing heat into the street. This is at least considered wrong, since it is possible to install the thermal insulator only in the case of the walls of the walls with the help of drywall, which is not always appropriate. In other cases, this is the same technology to heal the surface, which can be carried out in three ways, and more precisely with the following three types of heating elements:

• Warm water walls are the best option if there is an individual liquid heating system in an apartment or house.
• Warm electrical walls are ready-made mats or cables that have sufficiently high power consumption.
• Warm film floor on the walls - infrared or electrical elements that can be called in this case the most optimal decisionBut only if they are installed in line: on the floor, walls and ceiling.

Regarding the issue of materials for the manufacture of warm walls, in principle, there is nothing more to add. It should only be noted about the presence of small materials, without which no installation of such a system will cost. These include various fasteners, insulation, if there is an opportunity for their installation and other similar parts.

Before moving to the list of shortcomings of such a system, it should be found out the principle of its work, which in itself can be considered a large minus. Many people know that in the room the heat spreads according to the principle of convection or as radiation. The essence of the convection process is as follows: warm air rises right upwards, heat radiation spreads from the heating device to a maximum of twenty centimeters, and then again works the principle of air convection.

Thus, in the case when the wall will serve as one large element of heating, the space of space in twenty centimeters next to the wall will be warm up, and after heat will head up and remain under the ceiling, thereby having warmed the gear neighbors. In general, approximately this situation will work when it will be hot under the ceiling, and above the floor, on the contrary, it is cold, and in the center - so-so. Naturally, it will be extremely uncomfortable in such a room. Even in the case of the presence of the battery, the meaning of heating with warm walls is lost. Consequently, the only reasonable explanation for the use of such technology can be considered balob. Of course, they can be used to dry the wet walls, but in one way or another it will be easier and cheaper to extract inter-block or interpanel seams. The disadvantages that are in infrared warm walls and all other systems of heating vertical surfaces of the house, set. Among substantial minuses, the following can be distinguished:

As previously said, the installation of furniture is not allowed along the warmed walls, as they will reduce the efficiency of the premises, as well as the furniture itself, due to the impact on it, heat will lose moisture and starts to expand. Under such conditions, it will not last long.

When installing warm walls, you do not need to count on something that will be able to hang anything on the walls, for example, carpets or modern flat TVs. The reason lies in the fact that the fasteners installed will certainly damage the heating elements. If you need to install them, you should first plan a detailed scheme for communications, noting the place where subjects will hang. However, as experience shows, they think about it in the latter.

A large amount of heat loss, about which you do not need to say for a long time since everything is clear: the heating elements are for the most part heating the wall, and through it the heat obtained will disappear.

Such heat loss also lead to another important point - the dew point shifts inside the wall. In this place in winter Moist will accumulate, which will lead to the formation of condensate on the verge of cold and warm. In this case, there are two unpleasant factor: in places where various mold fungi will begin to develop, and in places where it is cold, it will freeze the wall in winter. As a result of the freezing and thawing cycle, destruction will come.

From the above disadvantages of warm walls, we can conclude that it is not worth a hurry with the installation of warm walls in the house, and you need to think about it, weighing everything for and against. It will not be superfluous to consult with experts who tested this technology for home heating. After that, if the desire of the warm wall device remains unchanged, you can proceed to work.

First of all, it should be paid attention to the need for a thorough calculation of the system to obtain a full heating of premises with walls. And this, in turn, is rather difficult. Therefore, it will be better if the calculation of the power of warm walls will hold an appropriate specialist. And the installation itself of warm walls can be produced independently.

Degree of efficiency of low-temperature heating systems, in particular walls, depends mainly on the amount of heat loss in the whole house. For this reason, it is recommended to carry out insulation of outer walls, while installing heating. At the same time, insulation from the outside will allow the use of walls as a heat condenser, and the internal insulation will accelerate the process of heating the premises.

The process of arranging warm walls is carried out in the following two ways:

• Heating radiation directly from the walls when the heating element (cable, film or pipe) is mounted directly into the walls under the plaster. At the same time, the pipes are fixed using special fasteners, and after the walls are plastered by means of a gypsum-sand solution, a securely binding wall and a heating system. The gypsum solution also performs the function of natural moisture regulation. Of course, plastering is allowed with a cement-sandy consistency solution not tighter than the proportion of 1: 6, however, the solution will give the worse adhesion (grip) with pipes and a large shrinkage. These factors will reduce heat transfer. In the case of the use of a film with infrared radiation, everything is much easier, since it will be enough to glue to a smooth wall.
• The heat transfer process into the air is performed for a false wall, manufactured, as a rule, from drywall, and at the top and bottom of the walls are made by ventilation channels to organize intensive air convection. Some systems of warm walls do not have ventilation lattices, and the heat transfer process is performed only through wall coating. The heating element itself, for example, pipes, are mounted to the wall using fastening clamps as far as possible to improve air convection.

Regardless of the type of heating element, the essence of the installation technology of warm walls remains unchanged. The only difference between each different options Heating consists only in the nuances regarding the fastening of heaters, and in all other cases, the installation technology is made according to the standard scheme, which can be represented in the following sequence of actions:

1. Stage of installation and connecting heating elements. Here is all similar to the technology of the device of warm floors. In case the pipes protrude as an element of heating, they are fixed to the wall using clips or special fastening plates. The mandatory condition for the installation of warm water walls is to lay pipes from bottom to the snake according to the movement of the coolant. In this case spiral scheme It is not suitable for laying the pipes here, since it is necessary that the coolant climbs upside down not only with the pump, but also by natural circulation. If it comes to an electrical cable, it is also fixed by mechanical way. At the same time, the mats are glued with a special cement-based adhesive, a plastered level surface is necessary for all sorts of films. They are in most cases laid out of panels or drywall.
2. Stage of wall decoration. This time concerns mainly cable electrical elements of heating and pipelines. With heating films, everything is much easier, since their glue on the wall between the frame fastening, which is subsequently curtained by any finishing material. The basic condition for the decoration of such walls is to create convection holes under the ceiling and above the floor for the output of heat air due to the sheath and the influx inside the cold air. Pipes and cables, in contrast to film materials, can also be shuffled on top. According to the standard, the lighthouses are first installed here, then they pounce the draft plaster, and the reinforcing grid is installed on top of almost fresh material. It can not be used here. metal grid. Then make a pure plaster layer, which is putting off and finish with the help of finishing decorative materials.